Dripping in Curiosity featuring K. Wilkes

Dominic Lawson (00:02.028)
What's up good people all across the world. This is the Dripping in Black podcast. I am your guest host, Dominic Lawson, multi award winning podcaster in many different genres. Many people know me for the award winning show, Black is America, where I highlight little known African-American figures and other stories. And so just want to say thank the man behind the glass S Square for this opportunity once again to be with you, the Dripping in Black family. Now, before I continue, now you gotta see the drip. Gotta see the drip right here, right?

So if you wanna, you I know you like the fit, it's dope, I know. So if you wanna be dope like me, make sure you go to dibkdripshop.com to get this and all of your favorite dripping in black merchandise, you know, from this gear here to mugs and everything else. But let me get back to the task at hand. She is a veteran of radio and TV. She is the host of the Pondering Thoughts podcast, a welcoming space for curious minds to explore life's big questions and fresh ideas.

She's also a bit of a hip hop here. We're going to talk about that a little bit, right? And whether she's podcasting, traveling, or saving the perfect cup of coffee, she is constantly embracing life, learning, and storytelling, which anybody who knows me is near and dear to my heart. I am thrilled today to have the one, the only, Kay Wilkes. Kay Wilkes, what's going on?

K. Wilkes (01:21.062)
my god, I love that intro. Ooh, I need to put that in a bottle and keep it in my pocket or something. I just want to keep it with me. I love it.

Dominic Lawson (01:24.006)
Hey, listen, you have black excellence in the building, you got to make sure you come through with it. But it's an honor and a pleasure to speak with you today.

K. Wilkes (01:35.587)
Thank you. Thank you so much for having me. It's great to be here.

Dominic Lawson (01:37.608)
Absolutely. Absolutely. So you know what? Let's just kind of start from the beginning. Who is Kay Wilkes? What is Kay Wilkes all about? What makes her tick?

K. Wilkes (01:44.547)
Sure. So again, my name is Kay Wilkes. I'm the host of Pondering Thoughts podcast, a podcast for curious and inquisitive minds. A little bit more about me from the DMV for those that aren't familiar with that acronym. That means DC, Maryland and Virginia. So born and raised, although I've lived in other places, you know, at a young age, I had a passion for the arts and theater. A lot of that started from my mom. And then, you know, moving on through high school, I was on a syndicated teen talk show. And then from there, I even though I was from the DMV,

area moved out to California because my goal was to be in entertainment. Worked in radio for a while locally when I came back to the DMV area. Did you know quite a few internships but life just kind of moved in a different direction and right now working human resources which is totally different but that passion for like entertainment and journalism never left and 2023 I decided you know I'm just gonna go and do podcasting.

And a lot of people that were close to me were like, this is totally up your alley. And the thing that I loved about podcasting, especially since I had a chance to work in radio years ago, was that it's my own voice. I didn't feel like I would have to compromise in terms of like my messaging. You know, I'm a writer, the producer. Right now I have someone that helps with editing, but I really like that. So I can make sure that whatever's coming out is something that's authentic to me. And I'm also a lover of music. I love jazz. I love hip hop.

Dominic Lawson (02:45.87)
percent.

K. Wilkes (03:09.395)
A lot of times I describe myself in relationship to other people because I'm close to my family. So I'm a daughter, I'm a sister, I'm a proud aunt, I'm a friend, I'm a cousin, and I'm just overall lover of life. So that's a little bit about me.

Dominic Lawson (03:22.316)
that I love that I want to hear more about that theater background and and that part did you play any big roles were you the person kind of like behind the scenes what was your role in the theater and things like

K. Wilkes (03:33.739)
So when I was younger, so my mom was a big arts person. I remember going to see The Wiz when Stephanie Mills was Dorothy. So that's taking you way back. But when I was younger, yeah, I did different plays like in school and then in the DC area as a part of a young thesbian group and we would perform at different places like the National Theater and then different other places. And so I was, I mean, I had like different roles and then.

Dominic Lawson (03:38.178)
Okay.

Dominic Lawson (03:43.776)
Okay.

K. Wilkes (04:00.483)
Fast forwarding into my 20s, I was a member of the Urban League here in, in Washington DC, and we would do like fundraising plays. we did a play, we did The Wiz, and I was one of the crows. And at first they wanted me to be the backup for the scarecrow, AKA Michael Jackson's role, but.

Dominic Lawson (04:15.68)
OK.

Dominic Lawson (04:21.463)
Mm-hmm.

K. Wilkes (04:21.657)
I really cannot carry it too and I was like, no, just stick me in the crow. But that was fun. So that was my last time actually being on stage and that was a while ago because I'm in my late 40s now. But yeah, that passion started younger and I have actually need to kind of catch up on a play soon. But yeah, it started at a very young age, but it started with my mom.

Dominic Lawson (04:39.288)
You know what, know, first of all, shout out to your mom. And that leads me to my next question because, recently my mentor bought me, my wife and my daughter tickets to the theater to go see wicked. Right. And I had never been to the theater before, like to watch, to see a play. know. Right. So Memphis, Tennessee, you know, this, any other 42 years old, 42 years old this past week, never had, thank you. Never been to the theater.

K. Wilkes (04:53.621)
Mmm.

Dominic Lawson (05:08.046)
And it was definitely an experience like, this is really cool, right? And so you hear about places like LA and New York and they have the theater and stuff like that, but we only have one here in Memphis. But my question to you is this, talk about the importance of young black children being engaged in the theater, whether it be on stage, behind the scenes, or just going to watch a show. Talk about that a little bit.

K. Wilkes (05:33.017)
Yeah, I think the arts in so many ways, I think it just really kind of expand, expand your mind. I know you mentioned that you're a huge storyteller and I think just seeing people just be being able creatively to tell a story on stage and sometimes there's so many things, there's so many things like in a nuance that I think is beautiful. And I think for a lot of children or black children, I think sometimes, especially in this day and age, sometimes we do not have voice or the words to kind of express the way we feel.

and for someone to be able to kind of depict it in certain characters and to depict it in different stories on stage, I think it really kind of gives life and voice to what people are feeling. Another thing I think about the arts in general, it just kind of opens up your mind. It expands your mind to different things. It challenges your way of thinking. And I think there's something to be said about tapping into that creative part of your mind and just seeing the way someone can, like I said, take a story,

create these different characters, then even kind of just kind of expand your mindset, I think is a beautiful thing. And I think if we continue to foster curiosity and creativity in young kids and young black kids, we'll be able to make a lot of changes because sometimes we have to kind of step out of quote unquote the reality as we see it, but we have to be able to imagine or reimagine. I think that's what the arts does.

Dominic Lawson (06:55.47)
I love that. I love that. And I think a lot of people don't really understand the correlation between arts and, you know, good grades, analytical thinking and things of that nature. Cause it seems like, you know, for years now, it seems like a real attack on the arts, you know, and trying to get it out of the schools and stuff like that was, which is highly unfortunate because that is how we, that is how we learn a lot of life lessons, right? You know, so I definitely wanted to pick your brain on that.

K. Wilkes (07:09.504)
I agree.

K. Wilkes (07:14.304)
I agree.

Dominic Lawson (07:22.242)
Talk to me about your journalism career in your 20s and things of that nature.

K. Wilkes (07:27.065)
Sure, well, I don't know if I would actually call myself a journalist, but I'll tell you a little bit about my journey. So from a young age, so like I said, when my mom exposed me to the arts, I think that's where the seed was planted in terms of me wanting to perform or possibly be in entertainment. And I remember vividly being around like nine or 10 years old and looking in the mirror and thinking and saying to myself,

Dominic Lawson (07:32.342)
Okay. Let's do it. Let's do it.

K. Wilkes (07:53.493)
If I am not a star, I don't think my life is worth living. Okay, that's very dramatic. But I think that I always felt like that's what I wanted to do. So like I said, you know, when I was younger, I did a lot of theater. And then once I got into when I was a teenager, I was on like this teen talk show, then I graduated from high school. In college, I knew I wanted to pursue a career in entertainment. So I did like quite a few like internships.

And right after I graduated from college, I still had that passion, but I started teaching and then I landed a job in radio. So I was working in marketing and promotion. So for people familiar with radio, you have like the street team, like the promotions team. So I oversaw the promotions team. So we would do like a lot of events. And then I decided to pick up and move to California. So I was working in radio here and I said, you know what? I was like, I'm just going to go. I'm going pursue it.

My best friend at the time was in grad school out there and I went out there to try to give entertainment a shot. I was there for like six months. Pretty much I was running out of money. was like, I can't believe I'm my best friend for free. Came back home, started teaching, and that's when things kind of shifted and I moved away from that passion. So was a teacher, I was a fitness instructor. I joke with people. I say, have such a colorful resume.

landed in HR and then, that passion never left. And I've been, was hearing more and more about podcasting and I was like, I'm just going to do it. I was like, what do I have to lose? And I think it's been one of the best decisions I've made.

Dominic Lawson (09:27.68)
Absolutely. No, I love it. And forgive me for that misspeak earlier. No, definitely wanted to clear that up. Hey, listen, listen, and listen, and you know what it is, you know, and Dripping in Black family, because I've listened to the Pondering Thoughts podcast and they put me in that field. So it's just one of those things where it's like, you know, I just assume. So forgive me on that. You do feel like a journalist on on your show. And once again, Dripping in Black family, that is the pondering thoughts.

K. Wilkes (09:32.215)
But I like that because I am an aspiring journalist, so you know, I'll take that.

Dominic Lawson (09:56.184)
Podcast you can find that on any of your major podcast platforms and I listen to your conversation with Dr. Daniel Swan phenomenal episode by the way So great insights as far as like from social media to AI And stuff like that and before I kind of get into that particular conversation Just kind of talk about your thought process and who you bring on the show Why you bring them on the show? What type of what type of conversations are you trying to have with them? Talk about that a little bit?

K. Wilkes (10:23.705)
Sure, and it's interesting you mention Dr. Daniel Swan, because I've had him on the show twice. And I agree, he is definitely a brilliant thinker. And for those of you who haven't checked out the episode, I just had him return on the show recently to talk about the effects of social media. But prior to that, I had him on the show in season two to talk about the intersection of race and religion, specifically from the standpoint of a black atheist. So.

Dominic Lawson (10:30.092)
Mm-hmm.

K. Wilkes (10:50.305)
He's done a lot of study about that. So it was a very interesting conversation. But in terms of like how I choose my guests, I really just follow my curiosity. Like I said, I'm a naturally curious person. So a lot of the topics are just generated by things that I'm curious about. I'm a big NPR listener. I love CBS Sunday morning. So every time I watch it, like something will come up and I'm like, my gosh, that would be really cool to have someone on the show. And so I just start researching different things. I'll reach out to people.

And because I have such a wide interest, it's a combination of what I'm interested in. Sometimes it's from conversations I'm having with different people. like, you know what, that would be really cool to have someone on show to talk about it. So one thing I love about having a podcast is that it gives me the opportunity to talk to people.

I have deep conversations with people that I probably wouldn't be able to otherwise. Like if it's someone that I was interested in talking to, if I was like, can we just go for coffee? They were like, no. But I was like, if you want to be on my podcast, I'm like, perhaps then, you know, we can reconsider this. So I love having a platform where I can do that.

Dominic Lawson (11:54.222)
Right. And it allows you to, like you said, kind of foster that curiosity and that low key nerdism you talk about in your bio for sure. But no, it was a fascinating conversation with Dr. Swan and talking about AI. I was really fascinated by how the kids raise your hands like this now, and now they just kind of, know, a little bit here and...

K. Wilkes (12:18.957)
Yep.

Dominic Lawson (12:19.574)
and stuff like that. I didn't realize that my wife is an education consultant, so I don't really go into the classroom with her as much. And so it made me like, wonder if she's seen that too in her work and things of that nature. But also, you kind of got into this conversation as well with him about generation, Gen Z and generation alpha kind of being, you know, not necessarily willing to engage in adversity and things of that nature. Kind of talk about that.

K. Wilkes (12:23.321)
Mmm.

Dominic Lawson (12:48.946)
part of your conversation with him, but also maybe some of the adversity you faced in your podcasting career here now.

K. Wilkes (12:54.953)
Yeah, so that was a very interesting part of the conversation. think that a lot of the kids now, think their level of resilience has diminished to a certain degree for a number of reasons. And again, like one thing that he and I talked about, I don't know if this was actually recorded on the show or I think I did mention this on the show too, just even from like working in HR, I even noticed that too, in terms of the difference in some of the younger.

I shouldn't say the young, I shouldn't say kids, they're not kids, but some of the younger, the younger people that are coming into the workforce. And, you know, it's interesting how he was talking about how social media and what they are seeing is kind of feeding, feeding that to, you know, to a large degree. So it's definitely a shift in terms of how I overcome adversity and podcasting. think the biggest thing for me is just having a good network of people.

Dominic Lawson (13:25.548)
young people. Yeah.

K. Wilkes (13:49.175)
that you can like bounce things off of. I tell people, I think one of the two best things that I have done as a podcaster is joining the Black Podcasters Association and going Afros in audio. And I say that because when, before I started my podcast, there was someone that provided like consulting services and she was a part of both of those organizations. She said, those are two things you must do. Those are the best decisions. And the reason why I mention that is because

Dominic Lawson (14:03.534)
Hey.

K. Wilkes (14:19.285)
As I'm kind of coming up against like some stumbling blocks, just having people that I can talk to and maybe like in a chat or if I'm going to an Afros and audio festival, like meeting people and just having that sense of community, I think really helps me. the other thing too, it's just like my sister, very close to my sister. So sometimes, you know, like I'm, really do not like social media, but I got on social media because of the podcast and that whole comparison thing.

Dominic Lawson (14:40.526)
You

Dominic Lawson (14:46.594)
Yeah.

K. Wilkes (14:47.447)
You know, I'm like, God, I mean, because prior to me doing my podcast, I had like a personal page, but I was like, I really, you do not need to see what I ate today, where I'm going, where I'm vacationing. So now just kind of getting into that whole, I don't know, that whole zone of having to post stuff and how many followers. Yeah. Yes. Yes. And that's, that's really, that's been really challenging for me. So just kind of working through.

Dominic Lawson (15:05.134)
You gotta give people a piece of you, right? Yeah.

K. Wilkes (15:14.519)
I would say just a growing pains of podcasting, but I will say having that sense of community, going to Afro's and audio every year, staying connected with the BPA and also I meditate too. So just on a side note, I think that kind of helps to keep me grounded and centered as well, but it's ongoing.

Dominic Lawson (15:25.623)
Okay.

Dominic Lawson (15:31.916)
Yeah. Yeah. I was going to ask you about that, that, that, that self care routine, because podcasts can definitely be a grind, you know, based on everything you were saying and, definitely that social media piece, as far as like, got to give people a piece of you and you got you and Dr. Swan kind of talked about that. And he kind of, talked about this phrase, the attention economy is kind of where we are, right? You know, that that's kind of what's leveraged, you know,

K. Wilkes (15:38.819)
Mmm.

K. Wilkes (15:51.744)
Yes.

Dominic Lawson (15:56.78)
Well, now that I think about it, because in that conversation, and I think it was either you or Dr. Swan talked about how you start to see some of these people where you saw them on social media at first and now they're getting like acting gigs and this, that and the other. And I know in your background, you went off to California, you try to be on TV and things of that nature. I guess I'm curious, what are some of those other changes that you saw? That's kind of different now where

You know, back then it wasn't about social media following and this ad and the other. Right now it's about, you know, about the attention economy. Kind of talk about that, those differences, if you don't mind.

K. Wilkes (16:27.715)
Yep, yep, yep.

K. Wilkes (16:34.497)
Yeah, I loved it when we were talking about that because I was like, I'm not going to try to get on my soapbox. But one thing that you probably be able to appreciate this too, given your background. I think the one thing that I struggle with even being a podcaster and it could be like my age too. Sometimes I get so frustrated because I kind of feel like right now the focus is, well, let me shift back. I heard this quote before they said at one time.

Dominic Lawson (16:39.662)
You can get on your sub box here if you want to so

K. Wilkes (17:03.065)
people will focus on doing something well to become successful. know, yeah, now it's kind of like reverse. Like now people just want, they're just kind of grabbing attention for success. And so I just like, for me, and I was like, I try not to be judgmental, but sometimes I sit here and I'm thinking to myself, like you know, I was talking about my journey. I'm like, golly, I remember I was like, interning that BET, interning that local TV station, writing for the newspaper. I was like,

Dominic Lawson (17:25.528)
Mm-hmm.

K. Wilkes (17:32.963)
you know, trying to grind to kind of work my way through. But I think that built resilience and it also built a skill set. And now I'm looking, I was like, all these people need to do. Okay, let me kind of back up because I can't even see the tone of my voice changing. But now I see people, they'll just have like a YouTube channel, they'll put out something outlandish and it's just having a certain amount of followers. And now they're getting like gigs, they're, you know, doing this, they're doing that. And I was like, I don't want to be a hater.

Dominic Lawson (17:45.422)
Hahaha

K. Wilkes (18:00.825)
But then I'm sitting there thinking to myself, these people who really take their craft seriously, I was like, and they are getting things that people dream of, but then again, my whole philosophy, sometimes life is all about luck and what you do with it, but it does kind of bother me a little bit because I think about people who really are focused on their craft and really take it seriously. Like they're like true journalists. Like a lot of times now people you see on TV, they're not really journalists, they're commentators. Even when you think about sports.

Dominic Lawson (18:18.936)
Mm-hmm.

K. Wilkes (18:29.369)
Like we think about sports journalists, you'll think about someone like James Brown, but now they have a lot of ex players that are coming in and they're doing a good job. But when you're thinking about like thorough journalism, you're thinking about like James Brown, Brian Gumbel, like those are true journalists and nothing. mean, cause it's good to have that commentate, you know, someone as a commentator, but there's appreciation for like journalism because you're, digging a little deeper. And I think that's what I appreciate. Like someone who just kind of takes their craft seriously again.

Dominic Lawson (18:33.143)
Mm-hmm.

K. Wilkes (18:58.827)
Not trying to be a hater, but I think you'd appreciate that Dominic.

Dominic Lawson (19:02.51)
Listen Listen where I am in the season I'm in right now. You have no idea because I'm having certain conversations right because I always brand myself as the person who you know when you go to the Oscars and you watch for Best Picture and The people the part that will film that wins for Best Picture is like everybody's like what film is that? I've never heard of that film. That's me Right. I don't have

There's the commercial success and then there's the critical acclaim, right? And so, no, I understand what you mean, but I also have understood and kind of noticed this though, right? Some of those people who have those large social media followers, they're actually good at what they do. Fair enough, right? And they have staying power. And I think the some that was strictly just follower based, attention based, like they get the shot, but it's like at that point that bill comes due,

K. Wilkes (19:49.347)
valid point.

Dominic Lawson (19:59.854)
And then you realize like, there's nothing there. There's nothing there. Prime example, the, can't think of her, her government name, but the hawk tuah girl, right? Yeah. Okay. That's fine. It's not important. She, she, she went viral, this ad and the other on this thing. And then everybody started like, you know, who is this girl? Who is that girl? This said the other, and then she started a podcast and then her podcast was like number three in the charts of Spotify, like right behind Joe Rogan.

K. Wilkes (19:59.865)
Mmm.

K. Wilkes (20:11.071)
Okay, okay.

Dominic Lawson (20:29.646)
and then Tucker Carlson or whatever, right? But recently she like fell out of the top 100 because once we started to hear more of her and this and the other was like, there's nothing there. She had a moment and now all of a sudden, like now we're starting to hear her talking to this and the other like, no, no dear, no, no, no, no, no. So I think it's a situation, at least that's what I've been seeing that like, you know.

K. Wilkes (20:40.601)
Mmm.

K. Wilkes (20:49.081)
Hmm, I'm gonna check this one out.

Dominic Lawson (20:56.032)
It's a cliche, but like cream always rises to the top, but I think cream also stays at the top, right? Because you get, could have a Denzel go viral, but Denzel is going to stay on top because Denzel knows it's a craft and a craft that's be honed, refined, retooled, refocused and all the things, right? So, you know, so yeah, so now I'm on that soapbox with you too, cause I'm definitely in, like I said, in a certain season of

K. Wilkes (21:13.773)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

K. Wilkes (21:20.387)
Thank you.

Dominic Lawson (21:24.574)
understanding the certain parts of this podcast business specifically. So, so now I'm with you. I'm with you.

K. Wilkes (21:29.987)
Good. We have more room. If anyone else wants to join us on the soap box, I'll kind of move over to the side.

Dominic Lawson (21:34.158)
I Love that I love that I am curious though kind of since we're on the topic You know when you were in California and pursuing that part of your career What were some of those you know things that you saw about? entertainment where you was like This part is cool and this any other but this part of it like no that ain't for me because I know I've been noticing that For myself as well. I'm curious if you had that similar experience

K. Wilkes (22:02.625)
I don't think I noticed like when I was out in California, I was just like in pursuit. So I really didn't get a chance to like kind of really break in. But when I was in radio, I remember there were certain things I was seeing and I just remember I was like this, some things just did not sit well with, I mean, was nothing egregious, but just some things that was just like, I was just kind of feeling, I was like, man, if I really try to move into this industry, I was like, it's gonna be a little tough because I was like, I can't.

Dominic Lawson (22:09.432)
Fair enough. Okay.

K. Wilkes (22:31.609)
compromise, you know who I am and I'll never forget my best friend. When I moved out there, she was like, okay, this is we need to do. She said we need to get you on a reality show and then once you get on reality show, that's how you will break in. So that kind of ties in what we're talking about earlier. And I looked at her. She was like, that would work for you. said, no, that wouldn't work for me. I was like, unless it's like something like HGTV where I'm just, you know, showing houses, I'm babe. But I was like, if it's something where, you know, you have to, I don't know.

Dominic Lawson (22:33.89)
Right.

Dominic Lawson (22:46.606)
Mm-hmm.

K. Wilkes (22:59.833)
be a character or a caricature, I was like, that probably wouldn't sit well with me. And just getting back to my intro when I was saying I'm a daughter, I'm a sister, I'm an aunt, maybe I'm just old school, but I'm thinking to myself, I'm still, I'm a Wilkes. mean, know, family is still important. I was like, I have a niece, have nieces, I have a nephew, I have a sister, I have uncles, I have friends, so I have to be careful. I mean, you need to be.

Dominic Lawson (23:15.875)
Right.

Dominic Lawson (23:19.864)
Right.

K. Wilkes (23:26.263)
true to yourself. It's not like I'm trying to hide anything, but you know, some things just aren't, it's just not worth it. And I just have to balance that out. There you go, today, kosher.

Dominic Lawson (23:29.336)
Nah, got you. Nah, some stuff just ain't kosher. That ain't kosher, right? Like that is just, you know, whatever. I remember I had that moment when we were at the Webbies. And so a lot of times when you go to podcasts like galas and award shows and stuff like that, right? There's the talent, the person that you hear on the podcast is the other. And like,

50 other people with them, like it worked on the show, like producers or like market, mostly marketing people is always marketing people. And they act more superstars than the talent does. And I'm like, you know, come on man. Like, and so I think that's some of the stuff I've seen personally where it's like, yeah, I don't, I don't, I don't like, understand the game and what it, what it takes this any other, but like, I don't like this part. This part, I don't, I don't like this part, you know, but,

K. Wilkes (24:22.189)
Was it like the pretentiousness of it or what was it specifically that just was just like rub you the wrong way?

Dominic Lawson (24:25.302)
Yes. Prime example. seeing as that you're from the DMV, you know who this person is I'm about to talk about. He was not the egregious person. was somebody else. Law story short, we're at the Webbys. We're in New York on the red carpet, getting ready to go into the event, right? And so like I'm in line, my wife's in line and Michael Steele, right? The former Lieutenant Governor of Maryland is behind us, right? He was cool. Not the problem here.

There was this young lady who was there with her team. She was part of marketing and this had the other, right? And she was like, she was talking to the security guy and she's like, where's the VIP and security guy like, ma'am, there's only one line. Like, no, but I'm in VIP. I'm like, ma'am, there's one line, right? So I'm like sitting up here looking at my wife, look at the security guy, looking at Michael Steele like ma'am, if Michael Steele is behind me, what makes you think you should have gone?

you know, above, you know, in front of us and this and the other, right? So it's like, it's that part, right? It's usually the people who I'm not saying they don't have important functions. Let me be very clear about that, but they're not talent. And so it's like, why are you acting like this? And so it's like, I told my wife and I tell everybody around me, listen, if I ever get like that, slap me, please slap me. Because like, like, you know, just seeing that just, just made me cringe, right?

K. Wilkes (25:25.315)
Yeah.

K. Wilkes (25:30.233)
Right, right.

break.

K. Wilkes (25:47.905)
It's like, what are they called? Like famous, adjacent or whatever? Like, you

Dominic Lawson (25:50.702)
That famous adjacent that I could put perfectly Kay put perfectly so it's like, you know, it's just It is what is Dripping in Black family We are talking to Kay Wilkes the curator and host of pondering thoughts podcast Make sure you subscribe to that podcast on all your major podcast platforms. I gave you a five-star rating on Apple podcast, by the way So just wanted to make sure I got that in there. So cuz you know here at Dripping in Black we support we don't help we support

K. Wilkes (26:13.421)
Thank you!

K. Wilkes (26:18.435)
Thank you, thank you.

Dominic Lawson (26:19.232)
And so we put our money where our mouth is. I'm curious though, what's the plans for you and the Pondering Thoughts podcast? What's the goals? What's the plans? know, trying to put it on NPR eventually or something like that. What's the goals for the podcast?

K. Wilkes (26:34.507)
Let me say like NPR is like my standard. Like when I listen to NPR, I mean, of course, that's like the gorgeous love, the energy, the vibe. think they're very thoughtful in terms of the they approach like the news. I'm like something horrific could happen in the world. And I'd rather listen to it on NPR than someplace else, because even their voice and then they always have like really cool names like Meghna Chakrabarti, know, Michele Norris, you know, it's like I have to I have to switch up Kay Wilkes. I was like, I don't know if that has like the NPR theme. But anyway,

Dominic Lawson (26:37.292)
Mm-hmm.

Dominic Lawson (26:45.87)
For sure.

Dominic Lawson (26:55.394)
Mm-hmm.

Dominic Lawson (27:03.98)
I don't know. I kind of dig it. kind of dig it. Like the K-Wilkes like, no, I think it's the, just the two syllables, right? Like K-Wilkes, I think it works. That's just me though. That's just me though.

K. Wilkes (27:04.109)
Get it back to work.

K. Wilkes (27:16.345)
Okay, okay, all right, all right, okay, I can dig that. But in terms of like long term, so right now I just celebrated one year of the podcast, feel that I'm still, thank you, I feel like right now I'm still trying to find my voice and really kind of determine what the next steps would be like ultimately like right now it's just audio, like I do a couple video clips on social media, but I would want to move to doing.

doing it on video so we can have more subscribers on YouTube. But I really feel like I'm still in the learning stages, but I definitely want to expand my reach. And not reach just to have reach, but to build a sense of community, to just really inspire people to think deeper about the world around them. So to answer your question, I feel like I'm really, I still feel like a baby, even though it's been a year, I still feel like I'm.

Dominic Lawson (28:02.926)
Mm-hmm.

K. Wilkes (28:09.153)
still like a baby in podcasting and I'm really, want to just be a better interviewer, a better host, a better quote unquote journalist, whatever that means. So I think that's like where I am right now.

Dominic Lawson (28:21.102)
No, I mean, I'm here for I think you do a wonderful job and while I think you may think is yourself as a baby Believe it or not a year in that kind of makes you a vet as well Because I don't know if you know this or not, but like about what is it after episode 3 90 % of podcasters are done Yeah, they're they're done

K. Wilkes (28:24.611)
Thank you.

K. Wilkes (28:32.268)
Mmm.

K. Wilkes (28:42.403)
that before.

Dominic Lawson (28:44.876)
Right and you know why that is right because like a lot of a lot of people have gotten the podcast and over the past couple of years, especially since 2020 and people, you know people have that one hot take on social media and then there's that friend you just start a podcast, right? You start a podcast, right? And then they start a podcast and they repeat that hot take. So yeah, that was that was funny. That was thoughtful. That was poignant. What else you got?

K. Wilkes (28:51.651)
Mm-hmm.

Dominic Lawson (29:12.578)
Cause remember to Dr. Swan's point, we are in the attention economy. So once you get my attention, you have to keep my attention. And I don't think that's the part. And that kind of goes back to that, that cream stays at the top part, right? I think, right? Like I don't think a lot of people who are going for the virality of it understand that you got to keep my attention because I know just going back to the hawk tuah example and this had the other, you know, sustainability beats virality every day of the week.

K. Wilkes (29:16.051)
Mm-hmm, mm-hmm.

K. Wilkes (29:24.567)
Right, right, right.

K. Wilkes (29:42.219)
Agreed. Agreed.

Dominic Lawson (29:42.478)
Every day of the week, right? So I mean you being a year end that is phenomenal and that kind of makes you a vet in the game believe it or not

K. Wilkes (29:51.171)
Thank you. And you know, you just saying that just drives home my point earlier when I was saying that one of the best things I've done is like join the black podcast associates and the Afros and audio, because the reason why we're here today is because of that. Like I met Sean, who was the creator producer of this show at that event. He and I started talking and even you just supporting me and giving me five stars. think it just emphasizes that importance of.

Dominic Lawson (30:09.656)
Mm-hmm.

K. Wilkes (30:18.115)
community. I was like, have to support each other. I don't think we should support each other just to support each other. But I'm sure there was sincerity in that. Obviously, you like the show because you're making references to quite a few things that we talked about. But I think it just drives home the importance of finding your finding your tribe, those people that are going to support you and help you and help you be better. You don't want to just hear people tell you.

Dominic Lawson (30:23.553)
right.

K. Wilkes (30:40.021)
yay-yay when really it's a nay-nay, you know what I'm saying? honest critique. So it's just been, that's been very instrumental.

Dominic Lawson (30:43.672)
No, no, absolutely.

Dominic Lawson (30:48.686)
No, absolutely. It's very important to be engaged with the community and not only to support community, but also allow community to help you. Right. Cause that it goes both ways. It definitely goes both ways. So, you know, you, like I said, you, have many different topics, you know, and a different type of guest on your show. Is there a guest or a topic or something that you really want to have on the ponderant thoughts?

K. Wilkes (30:56.692)
I agree.

Mm-hmm.

Dominic Lawson (31:17.292)
Right. It can be whoever you like. Maybe it's TT Michelle, right? Or maybe it's Barack Obama or somebody, right? Like who's that one guest? Like if I could just get this guest, it would make everything just awesome.

K. Wilkes (31:32.319)
Mm hmm. I'm so glad you asked that question. Yes. And Dominic, you being who you are, if you got inside connect, I'm just messing with you. I'll tell you who you know what you know what the answer will always be no if you never ask right. So let's see. There's two people that come to mind. But the first person is Wynton Marsalis. So let me just tell you like when I say I do love I love I love jazz and

Dominic Lawson (31:35.084)
Big game, hon. Big game, hon. Let's go.

Dominic Lawson (31:42.158)
I might I might never know

That's true.

Dominic Lawson (31:52.726)
Okay.

Dominic Lawson (31:56.878)
Mmm.

K. Wilkes (32:02.699)
Wynton Marsalis and this even ties into our earlier conversation when you were talking about the importance of arts. He has been a huge proponent of really kind of pushing the arts and appreciation of arts and jazz. And not only is he amazing jazz artist, he's really an intellectual. Like sometimes I just like hearing interviews with him. So I would just love to just talk to him about really just life. What are some of his pondering thoughts?

So Wynton Marsalis will be one, or you just asked me for one, but if I could just put like a, if I could just add a little bonus in there, the other person would be, Jason Johnson. He's actually, you may see him on like MSNBC. He's actually a professor at like Morgan state too, but I just love his insight. So those would be two people. If I could get them on my show, I would love to have them on my show to talk about a variety of topics. So.

Dominic Lawson (32:32.896)
No, give me, I want the second one. Give me the second one. Give me the second one. Go for it.

Dominic Lawson (32:42.029)
Okay.

K. Wilkes (32:58.669)
Those would be like.

Dominic Lawson (32:58.69)
Have you reached out to him? You should reach out to him. You should reach out to him. Hit him up in the DM. Like real talk. I'll give you an example. So.

K. Wilkes (33:04.289)
See now I'm speechless.

K. Wilkes (33:11.235)
See, I'm pausing, but see, I'm open to any feedback, so I'm listening. School me.

Dominic Lawson (33:14.67)
Listen, so I remember, so I used to have a business show, The Startup Life, right? It was about business, entrepreneurship, this and the other, right? And so I see this name come across my timeline because, know, obviously I'm posted about business and stuff like that. That's where the algorithm is going to be a fix to that, right? I see this name, Mark Randolph. I'm like, who is Mark Randolph? He got 2,500 followers. Who is this dude?

He's the co-founder and the first CEO of Netflix. And I was like, business show? OK, if I get this dude, it's going to be dope, right? So I hit him up in the DM. I was like, hey, Mark, I love what you're doing. I think you have a phenomenal story. I would love for you to come on the show, right? And he was like, let's do it. And he was like, let's do it. And so the.

The 150th episode of that show, Startup Life, I interviewed the co-founder and the first CEO of Netflix. He told me about how they started, the thinking process behind it, all the things, why he eventually stepped aside to let the other guy he started with, you know, kind of take over the company and move from the DVDs and the mail to the streaming and stuff you see now. But yeah, all I'm saying is shoot your shot, K.

All I'm saying is shoot your shot. And honestly, from there, once I booked him, other people saw that it's like, who is this skinny, awkward black kid in Memphis interviewing the co-founder and the first CEO of Netflix? And so from there, I got the founder of Paychex, and you're in HR, so you know who Paychex is. The founder of Paychex, the founder of Dunkin' Donuts, the founder of Route 21, the chief marketing officer of MasterCard.

the president of the board at JetBlue, right? And so like all these people start coming on the show because they was like, well, we gotta be on that show too if that dude's on the show. so it can, honestly, it can be like that one thing is almost like this chain of events that just kind of propels you. So see, this is why we have community. Shoot your shot, shoot your shot. That's all I'm saying.

K. Wilkes (35:29.548)
You dare you go see I think you know what we're talking about like black excellence and dripping in black but this Black excellence. I think part of it is like community like supporting each other So I appreciate you saying my sister said the same thing. She was asking me the other day She was like you should reach out to them. I was like and Just like I was just speechless when you mentioned I was like

Dominic Lawson (35:41.43)
Right. Right.

Dominic Lawson (35:46.606)
Shoot your shot.

K. Wilkes (35:55.181)
But then she and she and always say this to each other. The answer will always be no. You if you don't ask, the answer will always be no. It's like we don't have to lose. So.

Dominic Lawson (35:59.564)
Mm-hmm It would always be no it would always be no I would shoot your shot V I may imagine he has like a website or something I would just say shoot your shot like hey, I'm Kay Wilkes Pondering Thoughts podcast I really love what you've done with you know in your journey in your career and this and the other I'm a lover in the arts I would love to just talk about you know, know what you have going on your background your thought process No, I'll put it out there. I'm just putting that shoot you shot

K. Wilkes (36:16.665)
Mm-hmm, mm-hmm.

K. Wilkes (36:22.915)
Good idea.

K. Wilkes (36:27.371)
I love that. And you know what? If that comes into fruition, I'm going to reach out to you. And I was like, I may just have to send either one of them a clip. I'm like, look, this person inspired me, moved me, pushed me out of my comfort zone. So I'm here today. So, okay. All right. That may be my challenge.

Dominic Lawson (36:38.274)
Listen.

Dominic Lawson (36:43.724)
Because I just think the thing is like, the end of the day, these people like a Wynton Marsalis or Mark Randolph or whoever, there are people at the end of the day, right? And when you have a genuine interest in them, especially if you can pull out, yeah, I remember that one time when you was in seventh grade and I read your book and I was in, and you said in seventh grade you did this, like nobody knows that because nobody else read the book, right? So, and so that you,

You can be amazed how far something like that can go.

K. Wilkes (37:14.635)
You know, one thing I'm finding, and I know you probably can relate to this too. One thing that I'm finding being in podcasting, because I'm usually in, of course I'm interviewing other people is people really enjoy when people take a genuine curiosity in them.

Dominic Lawson (37:24.675)
Yeah.

100 % 100 % I remember having a guest on a show one time and I actually read through the one pager read the book and this had the other And it says something about farming llamas in Wisconsin. I was like that is a weird factoid or whatever and so I brought it up in the show and he's like, you know what? That's actually not true. I just wanted to see if people actually read the one pager and you're the first person

K. Wilkes (37:44.867)
Thank you.

Dominic Lawson (37:56.13)
who did that. And so from there, he just gave me gold and gold and gems and trinkets and, and, and, more jewels and rubies and Sapphires and all the things in the form of conversation. Right. But I think, you know, and I think you do a great job of this on your show, is like being just generally curious. Right. And I think when you're able to do that, you're able to have a greater conversation. That's why I listened to the podcast before I

I came on to talk with you, right? I think, you know, this is a human interaction. This is something that, you know, we're bonding, we're connecting on a different level here. And so it's like, when you can do that with a person, they're gonna, they're gonna open up more. My wife, like I said, my wife's an education consultant. So she always talk about this effective filter. When you first meet somebody, there's this wall that's up, right? But if you start taking curiosity into people, you start taking some of those bricks down.

K. Wilkes (38:25.305)
Thank you.

Dominic Lawson (38:54.188)
And now there's a flow of communication that can happen between us, right? So I'm shoot your shot, Kate, shoot your shot. Like what are we doing?

K. Wilkes (38:58.999)
I like that.

You know what? I should record your voice and have it as a ringtone. So every time my phone's on, it's like, shoot your shot, K. Shoot your shot.

Dominic Lawson (39:10.446)
Shoot your shot. Shoot your shot. Thank you so much again, Dripping in Black Family. We are talking to the wonderful and the magnificent and soon to be talking to Wynn Marcellus, Kay Wilkes of the Punterin' Thoughts podcast. We just gonna speak that into existence there. Kay, I'm curious outside of podcasting, like I said, you have run the gamut of like, no creativity and art and culture and this and the other. Are there any other?

Projects that you're interested in like, you know, I would love to you know, right for this So I would love to produce that or something like that. Any other projects you're interested

K. Wilkes (39:49.267)
thought about that. think that like podcasting right now outside of you know, the usual nine to five has been one of the biggest things I've been focusing on. I probably need to think about that a little bit more. I'm really trying to figure out how I can like leverage podcasting to kind of tap into some other things like things I haven't even thought about. Like I'm a big book lover and sometimes I've seen some influencers or some people started and podcasting they started a podcast and now they're being invited to

Dominic Lawson (39:50.498)
OK.

K. Wilkes (40:19.097)
I don't know, be a host and moderate someone on stage to talk about different topics. So, know, God willing and the creek don't rise. I think that would be fun too. You know, that may be a platform as well. So I guess I'm really trying to focus on black excellence in the terms of like how I'm producing and creating content for this podcast and just seeing how I can leverage it. But

Dominic Lawson (40:30.306)
Okay.

K. Wilkes (40:45.913)
I appreciate you telling me to shoot my shot because I think one thing that I really need to work through was just kind of like just fear. You know, just a lot of fear that kind of comes with, know, putting yourself out there because I'm, I would consider myself more of a private person. So even when I was talking about the social media, just that type of exposure too, because we're living in a different day and age. So you're just trying to be careful about how much you put out there. You know, even with my name and my information, you know, sometimes I'm careful.

Dominic Lawson (40:53.166)
Mm-hmm.

Dominic Lawson (41:07.342)
100%. Yeah.

K. Wilkes (41:14.297)
try to be careful about like how much I'm saying. So it's like that fine line, like, you know, I shared earlier what my profession is. And honestly, in the back of my mind, was like, should I even have said that? You know, you just, you're just so cautious right now with so many different things. But anyway, to answer your question, I would just love to see where else this podcasting journey can take me because it's, I mean, it's just been, it's been beautiful. Just the different people I've been able to meet, the things I've been able to do and

Dominic Lawson (41:26.096)
I get that.

K. Wilkes (41:43.767)
being able to kind of push me out of my fear and tap into my creativity in a certain degree.

Dominic Lawson (41:48.502)
Absolutely. You'll be amazed how much this craft, this industry, you know, a podcast, he would just open up doors like, wow, I didn't, I didn't realize that would be a thing. I didn't, that wasn't on my bingo card, but Hey, I'm here for it. I'm here for it. I'm here for it. No, I love that. I love all of this for sure. So we're rounding third, heading home here. I just want to say thank you so much for coming on the, the dripping and black podcast. You know, like I said, I, I, I,

K. Wilkes (41:58.583)
Yep. Yep.

K. Wilkes (42:11.395)
Thank you for having me.

Dominic Lawson (42:16.886)
No, definitely I'm a new fan of your work and a subscriber now of your work. And I really love your interview style and the curiosity and everything. You're probably familiar with Terry Gross that you like NPR. always says she, absolutely, absolutely. Yeah. She's one of my mentors from afar is what I like to say. Mentors from afar, right? You know, so, but no, she always says she just follows the curiosity.

K. Wilkes (42:20.258)
Thank you.

K. Wilkes (42:31.187)
Yes, yes, fresh air.

K. Wilkes (42:40.034)
yes. I like. Mm hmm.

Dominic Lawson (42:46.574)
Right? You know how people say follow the money. She just follows the curiosity. So I can see that in what you do and then definitely an admirer of that. So I'm curious because, we talked about at the top of the show that you're, you know, you like your jazz and you like your hip hop. I know you're a fan of a tribe called Quest who just recently been inducted into the the rock and roll hall of fame. can you get you did you did. I saw that you should have. You should have.

K. Wilkes (42:48.523)
Yeah. Yep.

Thank you.

K. Wilkes (43:01.824)
Mm-hmm.

Yes.

Yes, and I posted it on my Instagram page too. I should have tagged, should have tagged, I should have tagged Q-tip.

Dominic Lawson (43:16.364)
You should have, but just kind of talk about your love of music a little bit.

K. Wilkes (43:20.041)
my gosh, where do I start? So we can just start with the Tribe Called Quest off the top. Anyone who knows me well knows I love a Tribe Called Quest. Although I was finding after they were inducted into the Hall of Fame, there was an album that they dropped that I was not even familiar with. And I was like, here I am talking about, I love me some Tribe Called Quest. And I was like, I had never heard of this album. So I need to, you know, need to, what do call it? Brush up on that.

Dominic Lawson (43:26.54)
Okay.

Dominic Lawson (43:41.486)
Yeah

Dominic Lawson (43:48.813)
Right.

K. Wilkes (43:49.325)
When I think about music, know, music has just been instrumental in my life in so many different ways. So I'll start with, I talked about Wynton Marsalis and I remember, I remember when I was first introduced to his music, I was in high school and actually was this guy that was in the jazz band that I had a crush on. And so anyway, he and I became friends and we were talking about jazz. At the time I knew about like Kenny G and nothing wrong with Kenny G, Najee and

You know, I guess I wouldn't say like more, I wouldn't say like mainstream jazz, but not like more traditional jazz. So this guy that was in the jazz band, he gave me a, he made a tape for me. Yeah, I'm taking it back. He made a tape of me. He made a tape of went to Marsalis and that kind of just kind of sparked my interest. And a lot of times when I think about music, I can think about different, different parts of my life that were significant.

Dominic Lawson (44:24.984)
Okay.

Dominic Lawson (44:32.174)
I ain't mad at it. I ain't mad at it.

K. Wilkes (44:47.683)
And then when I think about hip hop, when I think about Tribe Called Quest, I can think about like different parts of my life. I'm not, when I said like old school hip hop, I'm talking about like MC Lyte special ed. I used to be big and Heavy D and the Boys but it just kind of triggers very positive memories for me in my life. And sometimes even when life be life in, I can go back to music, even when I'm preparing for different podcasts. And I think it puts me in a certain space to kind of help me get through. So.

Dominic Lawson (44:57.047)
Okay.

Dominic Lawson (45:05.25)
Gotcha.

Dominic Lawson (45:09.582)
Mm-hmm.

K. Wilkes (45:17.121)
Music can definitely be healing.

Dominic Lawson (45:18.99)
I love that. No, it definitely can be healing and definitely sometimes nourishment for the soul, especially when the artist can like just hit you with the right lyrics. Like, man, are you are you you in the side in the passenger seat of my life right now? Because you clearly know, understand what I'm going through here. Let me ask you this real quick. If we turned your life into a movie, right? Yeah. Into a movie. OK.

K. Wilkes (45:24.429)
Yeah.

K. Wilkes (45:28.045)
Yep.

K. Wilkes (45:32.247)
Yes, yes.

K. Wilkes (45:44.121)
Movie. a movie. Okay, all right.

Dominic Lawson (45:47.438)
Who's on the soundtrack? Who's on the soundtrack?

K. Wilkes (45:50.217)
all right. Well, you know, if Q-tip's up to it, we can, you know, hit up Q-tip. Winton. But when I think about a group that I think really kind of captures, I think me and my personality, another one of my favorite hip hop groups is Digable Planets But I think Digable Planets, even if I wasn't able to get Winton or Q-tip, if I could just get like them,

Dominic Lawson (45:57.09)
Yeah

Dominic Lawson (46:15.896)
Mm-hmm.

K. Wilkes (46:18.155)
I don't know, cause it's like that blend of hip hop and jazz and I think dig will play. was like, if they could do my whole soundtrack. Well, I mean, you know, we, still want Q-tip and yeah, but I was like, if I think I, I think I'd be good. I think, I think, I think they could, I think they could do it. Nice little Colabo. Now that would be fly. I don't think they've ever done it. That would be hot. That would be hot. Yes. Yes.

Dominic Lawson (46:28.429)
Yeah.

How about a nice little collaboration between Digable Planets and Q-tip? I'm here for it.

I don't think so, but that would be dope. That would definitely be dope.

K. Wilkes (46:46.583)
So I would say, Digable Planets will plan this. If we could, you know, work something out, I think that would be wonderful. Mm-hmm, mm-hmm, mm-hmm.

Dominic Lawson (46:51.47)
Gotcha. No, I love that. I love that. So before I ask this last question, just want to thank you so much again for coming on the show. And again, dripping in black family. If you want to get some of this drip, D I B K drip shop.com. Hey, listen, we got, we got to move merch around here. Okay. You know how I go. You got to move some merch around here. So D I B K drip shop.com for all your merchant and accessories from dripping in black. And so, you know, as a

Ask this question the S squares got a gift for you. So he's gonna cue it He's getting ready to cue that up for you. Here's something send something back real nice For you back to the DMV. So I want to ask you yeah, we like I said, we support we support right here. We do

K. Wilkes (47:29.241)
That's so nice. You do. I was like, now I'm gonna be dripping in black. I wore a black shirt just because I was gonna be dripping in black.

Dominic Lawson (47:37.134)
Yeah, see, I was going to point that out like it's clearly K got the memo, right? Black on black right here. I love it. I love it. So when you think about, you know, the prospects and where you want to take the podcast and things of that nature, when it's all said and done, what do you want the legacy of KWilkes to be?

Big question, simple question, but big question.

K. Wilkes (48:01.453)
Yes. I think the biggest thing is,

Someone who...

K. Wilkes (48:15.107)
Someone who sparked people's curiosity to really think deep about the world around them.

K. Wilkes (48:22.917)
and try to make the world better with just. Yeah, try to make the world better with in which way in whichever way that she could. I mean, it is kind of like a very heavy question, but rather be like my parents, my sister, my, you know, my my nieces, my nephew or whoever knows me. I just want them to feel. I want them to feel proud, feel proud, like, you know.

She operated in her truth and despite what we're up against in this world, like the world's trying to tell us things that really don't align with who we are morally, just kind of stay in the course and just being true to yourself. I mean, know, as a black woman, you don't need to emulate some of these people that are being given platforms. As a black male, you don't need to do that either. Be true to you and what's...

true to yourself, you you don't have to drop certain words in your hip hop songs, be you, because there is a place in the space where we need that. We need something a little bit more refreshing because we are on two opposites ends of the spectrum. And when people listen to my podcast, I want it to be the type of podcast that

even though it's not a family podcast, but if your son or daughter happens to be in the car and it's on, you don't feel like you have to cover their ears. You know, I'm not going to be dropping a whole bunch of N words or what, you know, I you know, I mean, you know, just certain things I was like, and it's okay. And sometimes I feel sometimes when you're a black creative, sometimes I feel like people try to put you in a box and you have to tell yourself, it's like, you know, my world is larger than

is larger than this. And so just being true to yourself. I just think, yeah, just really kind of sparking curiosity. want people to just really think deep about the world around them. And for the people that are close to me, I want them to be proud of the legacy that I left and know that I was being true to myself.

Dominic Lawson (50:22.254)
I love that. I love that. It's always interesting when people try to put people in the box and then they get to know the person and realize the box wasn't large enough. So box wasn't large enough, but absolutely. now here at Dripping in Black, we always trying to do something for our guests to kind of immortalize our conversation and our talk today. And we want to do that in black excellence as we always do, right? And so...

K. Wilkes (50:29.379)
That's right. That's Yep. Agreed.

Dominic Lawson (50:50.144)
Esquire is going to pop up on the screen here because he has a gift for you because we want to share with you that like, listen, we think the Pondering Thoughts podcast is on the big, really big things, right? Really big things. And we want to make sure that we were here at, know, Dripping' Black was able to like highlight where we thought we see you going. And so as you can see,

K. Wilkes (51:00.121)
Thank you so much.

K. Wilkes (51:11.925)
So nice.

Dominic Lawson (51:12.93)
That is a magazine cover with talking about pondering thoughts and this and the other and S Squared in a few weeks is gonna send that to you to immortalize our conversation here today. What do you think?

K. Wilkes (51:24.025)
That is beautiful. That is so nice. I was like, God. Well, if people are listening, they can't see it. But it's almost like this like little sunrise thing going in the background. It's like this light is illuminating behind my face. I'm all for it. That is so that's so thoughtful. That's so nice. Thank you. Thank you. That is so that's so nice. I appreciate that. That's beautiful.

Dominic Lawson (51:33.326)
Mm-hmm.

Dominic Lawson (51:41.527)
Absolutely.

Absolutely. Of course, of course, like I said, S square to send that to you in the coming weeks. Okay, if you would just kind of share, know, all of your social media handles where people can find you kind of plug the podcast a little bit if you would.

K. Wilkes (51:59.04)
Yes, yep. again, Kay Wilkes, pondering thoughts podcast. So on social media, you can find me at pondering thoughts podcast. right now I'm on Instagram, Facebook, not as active, but maybe you can help me with that. If you follow me, maybe we can increase those numbers. Why am I a lot more active on Instagram? Facebook. But yeah, so at pondering thoughts, all one word at pondering thoughts podcast.

And in terms of listening to the podcast right now, just primarily audio, although you can see a couple of video clips on Instagram. But if you check out any of the major platforms, Spotify, Apple Music, Amazon Music, Podbean, can Buzzsprout. So you can pretty much find me on all major platforms. So definitely check us out. We have some wonderful guests, wonderful topics. And again,

The goal is to spark your curiosity and to help you to just really challenge you to think deeper about the world around you. And I hope that after you listen to it, it may get you the explore the topic, think deeper about it, spark conversations. So definitely tune in at Pondering Thoughts podcast.

Dominic Lawson (53:08.366)
that if it is Dripping in black family, if you love thoughtful conversations, you definitely want to check out the Ponderant Thoughts podcast. Thank you so much, Kay. And thank you so much, Dripping black family for having us here on this very conversational and thought provoking episode of the Dripping in Black podcast. Please, if you would, once again, a we got mood is merged people. D.I.B.K. Drip Shop dot com. Make sure you get all your merch and things from that nature. Thank you, S Squared for letting me be the guest host.

K. Wilkes (53:15.363)
Thank you.

Dominic Lawson (53:36.246)
And more importantly, thank you, Dripin and Black Family for allowing me to serve you in this capacity once again. Thank you for listening. Thank you for watching. Thank you for supporting and thank you for subscribing. And until then, next time, be kind, be excellent on purpose, and keep it Black. It's a choice. Peace. And that's it.

K. Wilkes (53:56.835)
Dominic, that was a fantastic conversation. That was a absolutely wonderful conversation. I am so glad you, it was wonderful. I'm so glad you hosted.

Dominic Lawson (54:00.312)
Thank you. Appreciate it.

Thank you. I appreciate that. Like I said, you had the B team today, so I had to make sure I stepped it up a little bit.

K. Wilkes (54:14.207)
No, this was great. No, this was great. That was a wonderful conversation because like I said earlier, I was I was a little nervous, but as it started to flow, I was like, OK, so think that was a great conversation. Thank you. Thank you. That was great.

Dominic Lawson (54:20.568)
Thank you.

Dominic Lawson (54:28.554)
Awesome, awesome. Yeah, I'm glad. I'm glad. Like I say, if you're not, if you're still nervous after five minutes, then I'm not doing it right. So I'm not doing it right at all. So no, thank you for that. And so hopefully, you know, it'd be very helpful resource for you and what you're doing and this and the other. So S-square, you come from behind.